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  1. #1

    Newbie really struggling - think I messed up

    Hello! I am very new to koi and so glad I found this forum. I could really use some advice, I think I've really messed up!

    We have a new 7800l pond. It was all built and set up for us by a pond expert because we do not really know what we're doing!

    We have 4 x 4 inch koi which we added on Saturday. Saturday and Sunday they were absolutely fine, we even fed a tiny amount of wheatgerm feed which they ate happily. Checked water on Sunday and ammonia was just above 0, maybe 0.25 so we did a water change and added more microbe-lift aqua extreme which also removes ammonia.

    Woke up this morning and our tiny koi are at the bottom of the pond, fins clamped and desperately trying to huddle together under our plant/aeration box to stay out of sight. They are terrified and darting around whenever we move. They won't come up for food.

    Checked water and ammonia is 0, nitrates 0, ph 7.2. We're still doing daily 5-10% water changes to avoid new pond deaths.

    Here's where I think we messed up. We have a sleeper pond and the top is capped with decking boards as seating. We treated the decking boards with Ronseal which now we realise is very harmful to aquatics! Stupid mistake I know. The wood doesn't touch the water but could leaching treatment be causing this behaviour??

    Any and all advice would be very gratefully received!! Thank you!



  2. #2
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai waterdog's Avatar
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    Hi Sarah,

    Sounds like they have been spooked by a predator, have you got any herons or even cats near you?

    You do need to be careful with any treatments around the pond But it seems too quick for this to be the reason.

    I would try a nets over the pond and hopefully they will settle down when they feel safe.

    Keep checking the water though as you will go through new pond syndrome until the filters mature.
    Last edited by waterdog; 29-08-2016 at 09:02 PM. Reason: spulling

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  4. #3
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Andy1671's Avatar
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    Hello and welcome
    Where about are you, as some close maybe able to help you get on the right road
    5000 Gallon Fibreglassed Pond With 54" x 27" Infinity Window
    BD300 Drum Filter
    Artesian 0.5hp - Aquadyne 4.4c Beadfilter - PS4 Protein Shower
    Badu Eco Touch - EP20 UV Sterilizer - ASHP - Venturi
    Hi Blo 60 - Medo 45 - Spindrifter Bottom Drain
    Wide Mouthed Skimmer

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  6. #4
    Thanks for the advice, waterdog. Really appreciate it. Should we replace the top decking boards to stop any of the varnish coming off in the rain?

    I will wait and see how they are then and hope it's just nervous fish! There are plenty of cats around us. Never seen a heron but possible. We have wire all around the pond to try and protect them. Will try netting it tonight.

    Thanks, Andy. We're in Wellingborough.

    Cheers
    Sarah

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  8. #5
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion Andy1671's Avatar
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    Is there a koi club local to you. The hands on information you get is worth its weight in gold.
    The weekend of the 24/25 of September is the All England Koi show and you'll get plenty of advice and information there. Its at the Detling Showground near Maidstone
    5000 Gallon Fibreglassed Pond With 54" x 27" Infinity Window
    BD300 Drum Filter
    Artesian 0.5hp - Aquadyne 4.4c Beadfilter - PS4 Protein Shower
    Badu Eco Touch - EP20 UV Sterilizer - ASHP - Venturi
    Hi Blo 60 - Medo 45 - Spindrifter Bottom Drain
    Wide Mouthed Skimmer

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  10. #6
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Grand Champion lee63's Avatar
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    Hi and welcome sarah, its maybe just new surroundings and them being a little spooked. Young/small koi can be skittish especially 4 tiddlers, it will feel like they have been dropped in the atlantic at the moment so may feel a little lost and threatened. Give them a bit of time and they should settle. Try to be very calm/slowish moving and not be heavy footed when around the pond as to not spook them more. Try putting a bit of food in and then standing well back and see if they then seem more at ease and come up. In regards to the pond set up no matter how much filter start products you use you will get a bounce as its inevitable unless very bmvery gradually building it up from very littke food to more but it can take along time and i mean like a full season not just a few weeks to get a filter mature. Just out of curiosity what filtration/set uo do you have if you know?
    Lee


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    Its always a work in progress

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  12. #7
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Nanasai waterdog's Avatar
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    Pretty much all wood stains carry the warning about not being fish safe, one that seems to be recommended time and again is sadolin classic but even that carries a warning.

    I think its mostly a problem if paint gets into the pond but once dried it is less of an issue, try a search on the forum there has been loads of threads on pond safe paint. an example here - https://www.koiforum.uk/archive/index.php/t-9991.html

    Were the deck boards dry before the fish went in ?

    Still think its most likely to be a predator though. I lost about 30 fish in my first weekend to seagulls and a heron

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  14. #8
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Supreme Champion pondwithnoname's Avatar
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    It could be something as simple as a change in the water chemistry for example if they come from a retailers pond at pH 8 to your pond at pH 7.2 they'd certainly not be very happy for several days.
    Alias PWNN - Steve
    My favourite and recommended web site is......
    http://www.mankysanke.co.uk/
    http://www.freewebs.com/koikoi/

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  16. #9
    Extreme Koi Member Rank = Adult Champion Bigmel's Avatar
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    Agree with all the above .......i doubt its the stain .

    Can you observe them when they settle down ? ie without them seeing you , small koi in small numbers are very skittish for weeks in a new pond .

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  18. #10
    Thank you for all the help! They seem a little happier this morning and only spooked and hid as i approached (as opposed to all the time!) I think you are right and this may have been a predator. I will keep my eyes open for cats and herons. We have fishing line secured around the outside but this wouldnt stop cats, i dont think.

    Thank you for the reassurance. Yes, the boards were/are dry and they are not in direct contact with the water. I was just concerned that water run off might be causing it, especially with all the rain we've had. It was a clear varnish. I will keep an eye on them and just hope nothing leaches from the boards.

    It's an Oase Filtoclear 30000 and AquaMax Eco Premium 16000 Filter Pump. I understand now this might be inadequate. Maybe we should look at upgrading for the next pond!

    Thanks again for all of the advice!
    Sarah

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  20. #11
    Hi Sarah,

    Think you have been given some sound advise, they just need time to settle but keep an eye on the water quaility and possible predators. I also live in wellingborough so will keep an eye on the thread if things start to go wrong I can pop round and have a look, however just hand a knee operation( Torn ACL) so will be a few weeks.

    Thanks

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  22. #12
    Ouch!! That sounds very painful. Hope you get well soon.

    That'd be fab, cheers. Out of interest, have you seen herons in the area or do you think cats are the more likely problem? I know we have a lot of kites around and they do like to circle my dwarf rabbit but I didn't think a kite would go for fish!

    Cheers
    S

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  24. #13
    Thanks,

    Unfortunately yes I have seen Herons but thankfully I've not had issues with them, however that does not mean a great deal as they will take any opportunity they can, so If you ponds located in a position they can access/see clearly them they could visit Im afraid. However I would think your issues are due to them not settled yet,but would keep an eye out for cats/herons

    We have many Red Kites in the area and have seen them circling the skies but they are more scavengers than killers and dont attack fish as far as Im aware.

    Roly

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